What we need

[Driving Park]

Hi, I'm Driving Park. This is my first post on BZU. Some of you may know that I'm also a member of BZC and Dx's forum, Sector Zero. Upon discovering the internet BZ community, I have so far been making great strides towards my first IA missions. Map making may be tedious, but it's so much fun.

However, that said, several weeks ago after having BZ1 for about 7 years or so (can't remember exactly when I bought it), I decided to try playing online. The first couple of times it was great. I had some great games with some great players, on BZ 1.4 and BZE. However, I played again today and it was not like the previous times. In the lobby, i had a run in with "falsies", who instantly labeled me as an "a**" because I was on the bz1.net server but wasn't a member of bz1.net. I decided to ignore him and just go into a DM game, but then I was met by Tug, who after a while began accusing me of being a hacker. Long story short, he and several others began bashing me about everything, and I just kept saying that I'm just a new player.

Soon enough, after mentioning how in the lobby falsies was talking like one of spock's minions, they all began to bash me about it. They asked me why I would say "minions", they asked me why I would say "followers" when I responded to their previous question, and they asked me why I would say that spock is a hacker after that, all the while throwing blind insults at me. I simply referred to numerous threads on here and on BZC, proving spock's cheats. They simply kept lashing out at me with insults, and at one point Tug threatened to get me banned from the server if I said spock was a hacker one more time. In the interest of staying in BZ, I didn't say it again, but instead took it to the lobby, where I was met by falsies, Dominant, and Tug, and they all kept bashing me.

Eventually (the volley must have lasted for more than an hour) we got to the point where falsies and Dominant were spewing lies left and right, and we were arguing about forums. According to the spock side, BZC and BZU aren't real bz forums and only talk about bz2 or bze, which according to them is trying to destroy bz1. They accused Dx, TheWall, BFT and others of trying to ruin the game through hacking, which I asked them to prove. Of course, they couldn't prove it, but kept shooting insults and threats. After a while it became just a battle between me and falsies, who couldn't say anything but "dummy" and "dumba**".

He told me I was stupid for joining BZC/BZU and not bz1.net, which was the only "real" bz1 forum. I said, well excuse me for using the internet the way it was meant to be used. He kept bashing me, twisting my earlier words to try to hurt me with them. Soon enough he said that BZU doesn't have any bz1 topics and no BZ1 players. So I showed him the BZ1 section of the forum, and he said show me a post, even though I said anyone can read the post dates. So I showed him the most recent post, and he said it wasn't good enough, still insulting me at the same time. So I showed him the servers.dat thread and he didn't say anything. No one else was either, so I left.

My point here is not that I deserve from recognition for beating these spock loyalists. Nor is it that I should get sympathy because I was so harshly attacked, and for so long. My point is that I think we need an un-subjective point of view on this whole issue, because it's really hard to tell which side is right when both sides are making the same accusations. Spock's minions are accusing Dx and the whole BZU and BZC community of hacking and trying to ruin BZ, while we are doing the same thing. While I side with you guys (BZU, BZC, Dx and the whole BZE community) because we have actual proof, I think the only way that we can put all this behind us and not cause even greater damage to BZ1 is to get a third-party point of view, one that has all the evidence, and is not subjective to either side. That way, we can all put this mess behind us, or if need be, the necessary players can be banned from the BZ community.

[Warfreak]

1. Welcome to the Community.
2. Welcome to the "Spock-Bashed" Club.
3. While some of us have the same feelings of wanting this crap to end, we have to accept that certain individuals are too childish and low on self-esteem that such a thing would be impossible until some higher being came down and smote them.
4. What you suggest in the last paragraph of your post HAS been tried and doesn't work because of #3 (the sentence above this one  ) and the fact that Mother's Milk has some unwanted side effects when someone has been on it for about 30+ years.

After reading all 4 points and taking them to heart can you understand that everyone here (even those who don't even PLAY BZ1) is effected by this and we all have gone threw it. Most of us have just accepted it and complain while others still try to get rid of the problem. Spock and others like him will be the way they are until either they suffer a fate worse than death or they experience a revelation, both which are as likely as a cure for cancer at this point.

Once again, welcome and have a good time on the battlezone. (whatever your definition of good time is)

[Driving Park]

Thanks for the advice, I'll be sure to try to use it. And I'm still having a good time, as long as Spock's goons aren't on. That's my favorite part of BzE.

[AHadley]

Simple answer is to ignore them. Host your own game and play that instead. Or just try a different server.

Welcome to the enlightened Team Dummy.

[bb1]

I like his fake Tug, since obviously he does not like Tug.

I bit of my occipital lobe just melted off.

[Driving Park]

i'm not sure i understand. 

[AHadley]

i'm not sure i understand. 

Last time I checked, Spock was bashing Tug for being a BZE fan and one of 'Dx's cronies'.

[Driving Park]

oh i gotcha.

UPDATE: "falsies" under a different name has just banned me from the bz1.net server. Do I care? Nope.

And "falsies", aka Claire whatever, I know you're reading this because you said you read my post. You cannot begin to fathom how little I care about everything and anything that you say, especially since not once did you manage to say anything that was above the intelligence of a 5-year-old during your continual insults and blind, meaningless threats. You may have succeeded in banning me, but does that mean I feel hurt or defeated in any way, shape or form. No. It does not. It means absolutely nothing to me. I will continue to live my life as I have, completely uneffected by your actions. In fact, you have actually gone against your own, twisted principles because now all I have to play on is BzE, so I will. And I will promote it, and support it. So your actions will in fact backfire on you. Thank you!

[bb1]

In fact, you have actually gone against your own, twisted principles because now all I have to play on is BzE, so I will. And I will promote it, and support it. So your actions will in fact backfire on you. Thank you!

I never saw that perspective before 

Sporkinator, ban away!

[TheWall]

"Dear Mr. Driving Park"

Park, as I am sure you have figured out, I am a bit of a BZ vet, though much of the past few years have been very sparse and have become quite unplugged from BZ (IE - a few bricks shy of a complete Wall ).

That being said, you and I crossed paths in BZ 1.4 shortly after your first visits to BZ multi-player, and from my personal experience with you at that time and a couple/few times since, I think the way you present yourself in game, in chat, in lobby, is an ICON of what any reasonable BZ'r would hope for coming into the online gaming community. Your "GAME" may not be the best in the online community, but you as a person/player are/were second to none in my experiences with you.

Next chapter: RE: "falsies"... falsies = Spock, so... Spock meet Park, Park meet Spock.

RE: Subjective, Objective about the BZ community. It's actually very simple, you either "drink the Koolaid" or you don't. You either agree with "Spock" to such an extent you are essentially "Spock" or you embellish Spock, or you don't. If you express any opinion or view which is not 100% consistent with "HAIL Spock", "GLORY BE TO Spock", or some variation of it, you are then the Anti-Christ of BZ. The only way someone could ever be "impartial" is to completely agree with Spock's views.. which in my life's experiences and RAW LOGIC defines is not "impartial" or objective.

It seems to me that Spock wants to own BZ, and the community. If you object to that, you're out.

I've also been banned from BZ1 this last week, apparently because of my father having suffered a massive stroke this last week, and I have been visiting him in a Neurological Critical Care Unit at a MAJOR Hospital 60 miles away, and not promoting an ANTI-911 propoganda aggenda Spock believes I should have been promoting, to better "BZ", and not allocating to my frail, ailing father.

If all of this sounds a little "SICK", its probably because it is.

SOMEONE "Objective" needs to read this thread pretty carefully (coug.. k.. cough.. en.. ough.. cough), and  INSURE "1.5" CANNOT be controlled by one person... "OR ELSE".

EDIT:

Just to keep things in perspective... and keep the record straight: I have not played "BzE" for weeks (at least since I (re)built my Win98 PC), when I have played BZ, it has been BZ 1.4. That being said, I know I will be re-labled as a BzE promoter, which Dx would be quite disappointed in, since I doubt he'd think me not playing BzE for several weeks is much of  a promotion. And YES, the "1.4" players can verify I have been playing 1.4, and the BzE players can verify I have not been playing BzE.

[Warfreak]

Considering the developers originally and STILL only truly consider their job to fix what is broken and leave the community to do as it wishes, I wouldn't be surprised if we end up with another charismatic individual who ends up turning a slice of the community into 1.5 Extremists.

This also means we would end up with those convoluted enough to form a BZE group and so on until the entire community is fractured by only a few individuals and their rather shallow views.

Of course those all go into the "Worse Case Scenario" bin. While our current situation is as retarded I'm just glad we aren't a bigger community or what we would basically have on our hands is Facepunch.

[TheWall]

There is one thing I would like to clear up... as much as I may dis-agree with Spocks antics...

I've personally never heard of Spock hacking, nor had reason to suspect him of it. If he has/does and I don't know it... BFD. Everyone could hack BZ playing against me and I'd not know it... like stealing candy from a baby in that regard.

So, untill I have personal experience/knowledge with Spock allegedly hacking BZ, I'm not joining in on that allegation.

[bb1]

I think the majority of the BzE crowd would move on to the 1.5, as the reasons for using BzE are the same for the creation of the 1.5. Now BzE with the 1.5 exe, that would be the pinnacle of BZ. Those ships can really heave their weight around with those raptors

Someone from the BZC did their psychology thesis on Spock and his antics and studied him, got behind enemy lines, and documented it. Not sure if he was telling the truth or full of crap, but I seriously am thinking of doing the same thing. Easy A I suppose. Playing along to get deep into the mess may seem dirty but we gotta learn somehow.

[eddywright]

Anti-hacking measures are needed in 1.5. That's a major issue and from what little I know, its not an easy fix. Anything done in the beginning will slow hackers down but it could be just a matter of time before they figure it out and hacking is back.

I haven't heard too much about the protections added to 1.5, can someone update us on that?

I agree, BZE with 1.5 will be awesome!  I do like those BoPs and the rest...

Eddy

[Blunt Force Trauma]

Spock's minions are accusing Dx and the whole BZU and BZC community of hacking and trying to ruin BZ, while we are doing the same thing. While I side with you guys (BZU, BZC, Dx and the whole BZE community) because we have actual proof, I think the only way that we can put all this behind us and not cause even greater damage to BZ1 is to get a third-party point of view, one that has all the evidence, and is not subjective to either side. That way, we can all put this mess behind us, or if need be, the necessary players can be banned from the BZ community.

I've never quite understood the BZ angst over making a decision between "the flock" and the remaining community, especially if you're any rational person playing the game for the last 5 years.

And even if you're a brand new player, or a player coming back after several years. . .if you merely look at the objective facts, and then decide if that's enough evidence to allow yourself to consider and include the subjective.

What does spock offer?

Incessant accusations of people with insane (600 fps), (me for one...and I've used 98se since day one), full hacking, etc, etc.  Where is the proof?  Oh wait. . he has his 'Wall of Shame' and, of course, his ban list.

[/quote]


All I ask of any new player that wants to indulge in 1.4 is to use an IP sniffer, and simply observe other actions in the lobby and games.  I really don't want to go over it for the umpteenth time, but here goes.  Do you observe blatant undeclared teaming?  Do you notice an unusually high number of IPs that sit around static in the lobby or games?  Do you get warned harshly with 'punishment' of a ban if you speak positive of BZE?  Are you seeing well known names with the wrong IP? If you also visit BZE's lobby, do you frequently see the admin of spock's server over in BZE's lobby constantly trolling?  At spock's forum, do you notice post's changing oddly?  Do you notice "DM Dummy" or some other derogatory name he "decides" gets put under your avatar or name?  Has he told you, you are not to ban players, HE will decide who gets banned?

Now....the above is just the clear cut antics that are out there even for the newer player to see.

What you may NOT have seen yet is the snipe hacking.  (Oh, and by the way, spock is very much against turning off snipe in a game.)...true or false? . . (subjective)  Or you may not have seen the BZ1-dot-net admin Harrison link hard-core homosexual porn on his P and name himself 'Click P for BZE'.  (objective)  Or does the flock ignoring basic host rules (objective, however an old example)

Sadly, but true, at this point in time, with a community group under 25 for all versions, it doesn't really matter a whole lot.  As it stands now, at least to me, to characterize "the flock" as the final distillation of what's broken and horribly dated in BZ fits well. . .